If I am directed to fly a STAR and then also told to “expect vectors”, does that cancel the STAR so that I fly the present heading until I get another vector? Or do I continue with the STAR regardless and only assume a vector heading when told?
Yesterday approaching Copenhagen the STAR required a 90 degree left turn. I had been told to “expect vectors” and ATC was very busy so I couldn’t get in to check on the correct procedure. No big deal in the end, but it would be nice to have clarity.
When you are cleared to fly a STAR and also “expect vectors for XYZ approach”, it doesn’t cancel your STAR. You are expected to fly on the prescribed STAR unless instructed by ATC to “Fly heading X” or “Turn left/right heading X”, Usually on closed STARs it directly takes you onto the Final Approach Track whereas in case of Open STARs [usually] it doesn’t take you onto the Final Approach Track and ATC needs to vector you in for the approach. Sometimes ATC may instruct you to leave a certain waypoint on a given heading - “Ifly 250, leave EMROS heading 180 degrees”. Also, you need to follow STAR restrictions at all times unless instructed otherwise.
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In other words: the term “expect” literally informs you about things that you can expect to happen in the future. “Expect” does not mean that you are “cleared” or “instructed” to do something. As vATCO I use the term “expect” to inform pilots about my plan so they have an idea how to descend to make it work, for example: “cleared XYZ arrival/transition, expect shortcut/radar vectors to final” = do not expect to fly the full STAR/transition ==> arrange your vertical profile accordingly.
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I know what “expect” means. I was told to fly a STAR. Then in a subsequent transmission told to expect vectors whilst still on the STAR with no further mention of the STAR. Can you appreciate that this could lead to interpretation issues? I don’t want to tell the world of ATC their job - no way am I qualified for anything close to that. Anyway, doubtless in the real world this is a matter which is cleared up early on in the learning process, but I’m coming at this from the MSFS sim in my man-cave, and just sought a tiny bit of extra clarity. But that’s ok. I’m there now.
No, I do not see any interpretation issues. “Expect” means “expect”. It is not set in stone, it is just a plan, it is not a clearance or an instruction. This is how it is done in the real world every single day.
In aviation some terms have some definite meanings. For example, if you come across the term “shall” it has to be understood as “must”, it is not optional. The same goes for “expect”: expect something to happen, but until then continue as cleared previously, ATC will let you know with an actual clearance or instruction.
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This issue was cleared up politely by the first responder, Rahul, but you seem determined to make more of it than is necessary. Well I am not biting, and I am not interested in discussing the general semantics of the English word “expect” with you, Herr Fuchs. The matter is now closed. Wind you neck in and do not “expect” any further communication from me.
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Martin, if you do not wish to learn more about aviation, then so be it. I have tried to explain the meaning of “expect” precisely, in context to our simulated environment. You are free to ignore this piece of information, but this is your problem, not mine.
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